LMAO...

looks like u dont even know what are u talking about or maybe doesnt quite understand "immunity" mean? or just dislikes if that cheesy overused main will getting nerfed that i guess will never be, even its been complain like since 2 years ago.

now lemme quickly point out and debunked all ur claims:

1. immunity...thats already debunked 99% of ur claim.(all of kinds debuffs are useless vs immunity)

2. fm temp immunity= its a freaking level "72" "mystery" for "1" round...... its a "Prompt" mystery. botttom line that!

vs "pre-battle" "immunity" lasts for "2 rounds" also give u "100% resistance" and its a freaking "passive" skill.

i guess its already explain alot of the issues. just in case its still blurry heres the numbers:

1. fm: nin 700ist vs lm:tai 1.200 ist. so its almost double the dmg output. so fm can do ignite/sleep which is his key point "debuff" while sleep a disable type with low dmg and while ignite came with more dmg fater burner. its mean if ur enemy have immunity not only ur base grows attack almost 50% of lm, but u dont get extra dmg since ur enemy lm have immunity. and no u cant disable him or his swordman on the line up. so basically 90% of ur skillset are useless and further more. ur dmg not even near half of LM with "free" sasuke ninja buff and ur main buff.also also its go further... its even lower ur "not even "half" base dmg since they have "100% resis"

its mean u end up less than "40%" of ur lame nin grows and "all" of ur guns being shutdown. while LM gain crits, high grows. yeah so balance dude. i think water chaos/poison type suffer this issue also. while earth main just simply unworthy if lm can do like 5k dmg on lv 68 with same items and bp than ur 300ist shield literally does nothing, same its go with water main healing...it doesnt even matter.

what if we flip the game a bit. lets say 5.1 version fm get buff and its came along these lines:

- fire main clone get buffed: create a clone with 45% hp, and protect all team with susano'o amaterasu shield. if any of these unit/s get dmg its remove all the enemy shields and buffs, all the incoming dmg returned 2x and all debuffs to the enemy/s, and ignite and immobile them... (and since this game like to add word "furthermore" i will try to add it up also) furthermore this skill cant be break! u can only break this with kurama naruto and jinchuriki naruto.

with that in mind will u still see it fair/balance? or dont u think right after this patch coming up not even take an hour before people raging? and how its feel if this patch still standing like 2 more years. how about ur feel as a LM user? did u see any justifed on this matter just because its follow the CN version? while u will be whimming, fm user will response like prev lm user in the past 2 years is "ez, use kurama naruto bro or jinchuriki madara"... still blurry?

there are tons of imbalance around lm not only "calm mind","root warrior","anbu tactic" that give u 25% while other only get 10%. or the insane lm 2nd mystery.. tons of dmg while disable all team enemy, while other that on qoute are so called "casters" doesnt even burning/whatever to the rest (unselected unit).

i dont see how this is fun in a common sense, it was never fun to me and will never fun ...whats bugging me. how is no 1 can't see this issue clearly. i guess i will end this arguement since it will not lead us to any improvement whatsoever, pointless. peace... im signin out...

@CHROLLOLUCILFER : Ummmm... No, I don't know when did you started playing this game but I've been here since day 1 and fire main's passive was never work like what you said. It's always reflect the first debuff in each round, not everything. The passive that gonna reflect everything is belong to Itachi's Breakthrough Passive.

Mean while the other effect that got removed from fire main's mirror passive was the increase damage deal on ignited target. Back in the day fire main was called OP because he used to work extremely well with Tobi before the nerf hammer hit them both. I still remember we used 3 fire main, 3 normal deidara, 3 obito kid to nuke entire enemy field round 1 in gnw because mirror passive stack together. Good old time.

Oh yasssssssssss

That patch 1. That Tobi was a good boy. The only free ninja with dodge and revive... I think.

His chase did sooo much damage. Hit combo tai/nin ignite with knockdown.

I used him to climb my arena back in the day.

The best offence

is a good defence... just kidding.

The best part about Azure Fang is that she's super versatile with her passives, so you can make a lot of different teams with different strengths and weaknesses. I don't agree that her mysteries are the best, but... well, I guess everything else wins out.

Midnight's bloodthirsty demon always has me biting my fingernails, especially if you've got a strong offence-weak defence character like some of the jinchuuriki, that can't use mystery on first turn.

Clone spam is definitely annoying, unless you've got a strong, whole team wipe out move like Kage mysteries or some other clone killer. High float repulse chase with Pakura though... *shudders*

Scarlet was my first ninja, and he's got a soft spot in my heart. Used to use him all the time with Hinata, Sai GNW, Ino GNW, and rhino, which was my first summon (Killer chaos team). Alas, it stopped working since all these new nins came out and I had to face people who were stronger and had better ninjas in general. A lot of ninjas nowadays are immune/can be made immune to sleep, so it's a shot in the dark to use the feather illusion standard, which I consider to be Scarlet's best standard (bomb blast dance is second best). The clone double move thing is great, but the clone never lasts long. Oh, they changed death mirage. Huh. That's handy.

Have never used Crimson once, so I can't speak for him. Saving him...

Tobi good boi always live in my heart. But to be honest I miss SB old passive more than Tobi good boi tho.

the higher a ninja defensive stats are and the more significative a shield or healing becomes because they are flat quantities.

do not undervalue the effect of a shield.

if you have 12k atk/nin and 8k crit and you have in front of you a ninja with 8k def/res and 4k crit a 1200 shield will indeed appear as wholly useless, but if you are in front of a ninjas with 14k def/res, 12k crit and 3k damage reduction then that shield is the chinese great wall for you even if is still, the same, 1200 shield granted by an earth main with 12000 basic resistance.

shields are exactly like healings, just that they can stack, they can't be denied by ignition (but only by clearing effects) and that they have no upper cap.

This list is practically the opposite of what meta mains are.

Of course, it's an opinionated piece however this list completely ignores the most used main in terms of PvP content (1v1 Spacetime)

Right now, It's simply

1/2. Earth/Wind Main

3. Fire Main

4. Lighting Main

5. Water Main.

There's practically too many weakness when regrading the bottom mains. While the best supporting ones, tend to shine the most as the game progresses.

i think this list is valid in early/mid game, when you still don't have good enough ninjas to build your team around. in such a case, you depend on your main for reliable damage and support. AF and MB have that.

but as you and the rest of the players grow, you get more ninjas to take into consideration, and you can finally start to build teams based on good dps ninjas. then more people start gravitating towards earth/wind main.

i think u are missleading us at somepoint. just to be clear... as u progressing all ur basic stats are incresed. its mean on end game is the battle of resourses.. either its from refine etc. if the shield that made by % of resistance, ofc the enemy attack also growed. if u were talking 12k atk+8kcrit vs 14kdef/12k crit... its even on same bp tier? im super surely it not the case. u are talking quite alot bp gap there my friend with 3k dmg reduction,etc. so lets do simple math: 14k def/resis=10% shield=1.4k shield in total/turn if not using any double std attack ninja/skill in this case are earth man. u might get 20% but as a base line we use 10% that are more common thing. so its mean. by 12k atk-1.4k shield=10.6k left,and those 10.6k reduce by armor etc. so the shield alone doesnt seem that great are they but if u are added more variable into it like 14k def u mention before and 3k dmg reduction, thats w whole diferrent story. *so the fact by doing sheild ur earth main cant do attack if u want to stack em. so keep that in mind. so each turn u get around 10.6k dmg gross while doing 0 dmg output on 1 on 1 scenario.

Really funny who ever bring only main into battle. I did face that situation when all ninja dies ( both side) I had 12k shield and 30k hp on my earth main I use only shield buff so no damage and he LM had 23k hp 0 shield and did 6-7k std damage each round till end of the round he lose because he had low hp even he had more BP. This thread talk but the lineup also so no need main VS main. I use LM Currently yet I don't really think he that op.

simple math.6k-12k= -6k

that's true but it's an immunity that runs out in 2 rounds... After that the immunity ends and you become vulnerable... And you can still interrupt even if you don't control the chars in case you have more ini than the guy

i would say the immune teams are the most trendy now... Currently what i see most is lightning mains and breeze dancers both on space time and sage world... Even if the rest of the chars are immune, the main character if not immune will be the weak spot of the squad... But the lightning main has a huge advantage over the breeze dancer concerning the immune squads, anbu tactics that allows immune chars to recover crazy amounts of health with tai attacks... But i think currently all characters are very balanced depending on the used teams, to the exception of azure fang unless they use triple heals lol

yes, after two rounds the immunity will end , but he will kill you before the third round xD

so no chance to you if he kill your main xD

now that depends on which teams they are using xD barely anyone uses the lightning armor nowadays cause it's super easy to counter and to fast kill that's the best mystery, or if you're using another mystery, the lightning main has to be fully buffed and the azure can't have buff removers on her side for the lightning main to kill azure in 1 round

Simple answer : BS

It should be 12k - 6k = 6k. LM ain't that thick compared others. Once immune gone or been remove he done for good.

Shields are good but they have their weaknesses as well. Shields can't be boosted, heals can (Hokage Tsunade, WM Healing Tips). Shields are a straight 10% resist (The standard anyways). In terms of Shield standard vs WM Heal, I feel like the WM heal is marginally better. Removing all debuffs, healing and has a chance of healing 2 people? Whereas Shield Standard is 10% with a chance of being 20%.

While yes, shields can be stacked. Shields disappear after 3 rounds of NOT being refreshed. That alone makes them weaker. Heals do not disappear. I mean, sure, ignite prevents it, but the standard still removes the ignite status. I can still put a shield on someone ignited, but it doesn't remove the ignite so they still take the 1999 ignite damage.

It's not so much as undervaluing a shield, it's more that comparatively, it isn't nearly as strong as WM healing.

Yeah. But if u had big 1 hitter plus 2 healer ninja and earth main do shield u sure can beat hokage tsunade WM Team even it big gap BP. I did once In matsuri Use Deidara and also 2 healer against kushina hokage tsunade and Deidara . so I think all main good but what ninja That can suit/synergies with them.

I don't consider LA/HK as pioneers of metas and how the game "evolves"

They're generally behind UK/NY in terms of changing what is used and frankly, the gap between the top to average players are massive to be competitive

UK being the gold standard of metas, while NY follows.

Of course, each have their own experiences but from actual reviewing and generally seeing the gap between each region on a daily basis. It shows how consistent PvP is between each region.

Currently, It's Earth/Wind as the clear cut standard mains.

Fire for first turns and mirror.

LM for Root which at this point is extremely null

and Water (She's just weak at our state of the game)