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defensive lineups MIA? And the imposition of one single way to play.

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  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2018-12-29 05:53:32Show this Author OnlyDescending Order
1# Go To

I was wondering if we will ever be able to run again defensive lineups.


it's over 1 year that this policy doesnt' pay off anymore, that is basically impossible to run heavy healing or heavy shielding/defensive lineups, and, honestly speaking, i'm quite sick of being compelled to overstack 1 move just to be decently competitive.


I don't like this game style, I liked to run defensive or healing setups (and i did it for over 1 year in my early game time, having a lot of fun at the time by doing so) and i was perfectly fine in losing against whales, as far as was a win with a very minimum amount of skill from the whale.


But the game went so far away in letting us overstack 1 move without literally any side effects that makes no more sense to think about anything else but overstacking move 1 (and talks a 210k power here).


In the past people complained about this fact, but i never honestly thought it was true.

Now i began to understand them.


Am I the only one that feels he is compelled in following game mechanics that does not like just because Oasis imposes on us to behave that way, not letting us choose among any other options but going for damaging stats and initiative on 1 single move?


Feel free to comment.




  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2018-12-29 09:44:06Show this Author Only
2#

Short answer, probably not. The advantage those teams had were that there were very few ninjas that could solo carry fights or those that had insane scaling (besides 6 tails naruto). Lightning main buff teams are the only ones that come to mind for me.


And to be completely honest, I hated those teams where all a player did was wait for 10 rounds. It seemed so idiotic to me that all a person had to do was just run earth main with steel body, gaara, gakido, and sailor sakura and they could basically win against anything their power. You said it yourself, the only people you lost to were whales. You probably are the reason why some F2P quit the game if you consistently ran that team for a year.


You can still run defensive style lineups, but being defensive cant be the only thing they are good at. Hybrid lineups are honestly the way to go unless you are in the top 50 of your entire space time cluster.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2018-12-29 09:52:44Show this Author Only
3#

to be fair oasis didnt impose anything on you. People found out out the best way to play, and they want to win so they stack spot 1. I would say if you want to be defensive they just released 2 good characters to help reduce damage, being bald head and edo itachi. You could run six paths naruto basically unkillable being immune and dodging everything. hokage minato has nice defensive buffs. Edo 4 tails gives jinchurki's defensive buffs. there are things you could run if you want to tank.


And there are downsides to putting everything in your position 1. If you get hit by an edo 3rd hokage basically everyone except your position 1 is going to die or be super low. And just my opinion i prefer this meta where we stack spot 1, over the 2 healers 2 jinchurki meta where we live and outscale you with poison dot. That was the worst of times imo.


Ice* just posted a few images of resistance stacking on the forums https://forum-narutoen.oasgames.com/page/show-post-37995-1.html there are ways to have your playstyle still




This post was last edited by How are all the on 2018-12-29 09:57:55.
  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2018-12-29 10:47:43Show this Author Only
4#

u kno oasis can't really impose anything right? they just give us ninjas and we figure out what to do with them

the playerbase is a living breathing collective, and by learning/adapting/etc we learn to make metas with the ninjas we're given. that's why we have different-ish metas from CN even though the ninjas are the same (or when we compare them to the points when they were the same)


social science aside, no one's actually stopping u from playing defensive. there are still a bunch of ninjas with healing/defensive buffs (hello chiriku?). the rest of us just prefer fast, aggressive games compared to defensive, passive, 10-round games.

  • Registered: 2018-08-02
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On 2018-12-29 11:22:38Show this Author Only
5#

I mean, with edo jin and edo itachi. Defensive line up gonna start to come up. Now let's just wait for kushina's breakthrough.

  • Registered: 2018-05-04
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On 2018-12-29 14:13:59Show this Author Only
6#
  • Steve Carry On 2018-12-29 11:22:38
  • I mean, with edo jin and edo itachi. Defensive line up gonna start to come up. Now let's just wait for kushina's breakthrough.

Unless your every position has high substats even with Edo Itachi you can get oneshot with 20k+ crit/injury Hiruzen and other ninjas. Defensive lineups need every position to resemble "stacked move 1", I used Chiriku+EM+Hokage Minato today in ST versus a player with 16k substats Angel Konan (my move 1 is 20k substats). Even with all the defensive ninjas it still came out to Konan vs Minato (my p2-p4 9-7k) in the end, although they survived 1st Konan mystery.

  • Registered: 2018-08-02
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On 2018-12-29 14:52:29Show this Author Only
7#
  • żółw On 2018-12-29 14:13:59
  • Unless your every position has high substats even with Edo Itachi you can get oneshot with 20k+ crit/injury Hiruzen and other ninjas. Defensive lineups need every position to resemble "stacked move 1", I used Chiriku+EM+Hokage Minato today in ST versus a player with 16k substats Angel Konan (my move 1 is 20k substats). Even with all the defensive ninjas it still came out to Konan vs Minato (my p2-p4 9-7k) in the end, although they survived 1st Konan mystery.

Unless the power difference is really big, I don't believe that edo hiruzen can oneshot edo itachi line-up.

  • Registered: 2018-01-25
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On 2018-12-29 20:41:41Show this Author Only
8#

Well believe me 10 round games are common things nowadays because of the overstacked pos 1 which makes a game where in the end 100% you will see just 2 ninjas attacking each other till the round exceed limit.Well defensive lineups arent bad in common use but they definitely arent qualified for your first team.The meta in the end of the day wiill neeed something where you need to finish things FAST.Thats why people are mass using edo hiruzen, especially now that we have the chakra cultivation where basically does much more dmg that it did (which honestly was trrash but now is reallly good),or minato jonin + madara 5k which for me are really teams that are definitely worth to have no matter what direction meta will have from now on.We seen naruto 6p take the spotlight but if you ask me he is good for ''winning matches'' but definitely NOT FAST.He is a beast in arena,,, in matsuri, in daily things where you need to win BUT not for sage and not for training.I really get pissed of when i experience a 10 round match which basically takes half of sage time.or training grounds with people that dont know how things work.In sage/grounds you need to be fast,dont be unreasonable and damage both yourself and your opponent.Thats the same thing with so called defensive line ups.I use them especially in matsuri but nah dont do this dude.Seriously stop using these crap in sage and ground really doesnt make sense except if you have made your mind to piss of guys




This post was last edited by CHROLLOLUCILFER on 2018-12-29 20:42:33.
  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2018-12-30 23:20:00Show this Author Only
9#

thank you for your answers.

i wanted to hear the opinions of other players before replying.


@Stevecarry


it can do it.

if you are, lets say, 60-45-45-45k and your enemy is 100k-30k-30k-30k (that's quite common for ultraoverstackers), you have the same total power, but the latter will oneshot you with ease.


@Chrollolucifer: you are perfectly right, in the end, the fights still end in round 8+ when two overstackers meet each other. what changes is that is just a battle between two ninjas. In swb i use AGK (i chose her over hiruzen because she generally works better against comparable powers and still nukes the low powers as fast as him) but i see i'm literally compelled in using her + kisame samehada + hokage minato because i can kill all those edo hiruzen teams even up to 70k stronger (i don't understand why they continue to select me when they know is 80%+ sure defeat for them, but seems they like to get their streak cut off by me) and is still fast enough to let me be in the worst case 4th-5th and most of the times 2nd or 3rd. I'm level 104, i can't hope in anything better than this since i'm just a low casher.

about the battlegroud i literally don't understand what's the point of people around my power or higher, overall if they recharge, in going in the only event where f2p can hope to cap their sun scrolls. i just consider their presence there the meaniest thing possible there is in this game.

btw, thanks for your reply :-)


@Kuebiko: what's stopping me from playing defensively is the fact they don't bring back +4 elemental resistances, they continue to show only features that grant more atk/nin than def/res, the cost of increasing defense, resistance and damage reduction is too high in comparison with the cost required to increase atk and nin, etc...

you can't go for any defensive lineup at the point of the game I am (over 200k power).

they simply do not work.


@Bosshog: thanks for your reply. I'm in ICEx server, i help him sometimes in doing those tests, so i know them very well. But what i meant by talking about defensive lineups missing is that if i spend the same 50k coupons in defensive stats instead of damaging stats, i don't get at all the some outcome, overall if i miss initiative. to get the same outcome as spending 50k in attacking stats i would need to spend 200k in defensive stats. That's the problem.


@Thunderstuck17: I am in top50. That said, if what you say was true, you would see half people going for defensive lineups and half people going for attacking lineups. why this doesn't happen? because is not possible at all to run defensive lineups right now if you are over 150k power.

  • Registered: 2018-08-02
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On 2018-12-31 00:16:39Show this Author Only
10#
  • Garv On 2018-12-30 23:20:00
  • thank you for your answers.

    i wanted to hear the opinions of other players before replying.


    @Stevecarry


    it can do it.

    if you are, lets say, 60-45-45-45k and your enemy is 100k-30k-30k-30k (that's quite common for ultraoverstackers), you have the same total power, but the latter will oneshot you with ease.


    @Chrollolucifer: you are perfectly right, in the end, the fights still end in round 8+ when two overstackers meet each other. what changes is that is just a battle between two ninjas. In swb i use AGK (i chose her over hiruzen because she generally works better against comparable powers and still nukes the low powers as fast as him) but i see i'm literally compelled in using her + kisame samehada + hokage minato because i can kill all those edo hiruzen teams even up to 70k stronger (i don't understand why they continue to select me when they know is 80%+ sure defeat for them, but seems they like to get their streak cut off by me) and is still fast enough to let me be in the worst case 4th-5th and most of the times 2nd or 3rd. I'm level 104, i can't hope in anything better than this since i'm just a low casher.

    about the battlegroud i literally don't understand what's the point of people around my power or higher, overall if they recharge, in going in the only event where f2p can hope to cap their sun scrolls. i just consider their presence there the meaniest thing possible there is in this game.

    btw, thanks for your reply :-)


    @Kuebiko: what's stopping me from playing defensively is the fact they don't bring back +4 elemental resistances, they continue to show only features that grant more atk/nin than def/res, the cost of increasing defense, resistance and damage reduction is too high in comparison with the cost required to increase atk and nin, etc...

    you can't go for any defensive lineup at the point of the game I am (over 200k power).

    they simply do not work.


    @Bosshog: thanks for your reply. I'm in ICEx server, i help him sometimes in doing those tests, so i know them very well. But what i meant by talking about defensive lineups missing is that if i spend the same 50k coupons in defensive stats instead of damaging stats, i don't get at all the some outcome, overall if i miss initiative. to get the same outcome as spending 50k in attacking stats i would need to spend 200k in defensive stats. That's the problem.


    @Thunderstuck17: I am in top50. That said, if what you say was true, you would see half people going for defensive lineups and half people going for attacking lineups. why this doesn't happen? because is not possible at all to run defensive lineups right now if you are over 150k power.

I went against edo hiruzen line up in the last SWB, pretty basic lineup with asuma and shisui, i dont remember the main, either earth or fire. His power is double of my power 50k vs 100k, I met him twice, he can't oneshot me in both case. The defense I have is chiriku, iruka's shield and wind main resistance buff.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 102
  • Posts: 177
On 2018-12-31 16:26:51Show this Author Only
11#

skill based teams are out the window , its run evasion ninjas or GG with wind main immunites and mystery reset its nearly impossible to beat team with shisui , either of the minato's , and now the 6 paths naruto being broken, immunities , dodge and mystery reset are slowly killing this game , over 200 ninjas , only really 3 viable teams out there

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2019-01-01 00:29:23Show this Author Only
12#
  • Steve Carry On 2018-12-31 00:16:39
  • I went against edo hiruzen line up in the last SWB, pretty basic lineup with asuma and shisui, i dont remember the main, either earth or fire. His power is double of my power 50k vs 100k, I met him twice, he can't oneshot me in both case. The defense I have is chiriku, iruka's shield and wind main resistance buff.

yep, that's why i use agk + hokage minato, because is full of edo hiruzen lineups in swb among the whales.

but the problem is not that team. Actually that team is one of the easiest to counter teams.

If was that one the problem in spacetime or matsuri you could just go with an overstacked tendo that fully counters edo hiruzen when left 1vs1.




This post was last edited by Garv on 2019-01-01 00:30:12.
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