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[ Player Guide ] Debuff Tiers Full List (Collab. with YujinTakara)

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  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 50
  • Posts: 600
On 2018-10-09 23:30:16Show this Author OnlyDescending Order
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Hey guys!


This was an experiment done with YujinTakara, in an effort to categorize and rank the debuffs within the game. We covered 10 debuffs in total, and here are the results:


First clear priority: Slow, Immobile, Sleep, Acupuncture, Paralysis, Blindness

Second clear priority: Chaos

Third clear priority: Poison, Ignition

Last clear priority: Tag, Imprison


Belatedly, I realise that another player has also come to the same conclusions. Check out Xerneis' thread here for more details and insights. But the process of testing and verifying is always fruitful anyway, cos there's always something new to learn! (and also experiencing something first hand is a good way to remember things)


This is a small summary of the tests I carried out, cross-referenced with Yujin's table (re-organized for my own convenience) which you can find in his thread here where he discusses in more detail the parameters he used.

tier list

add: i had to use regular haku to apply acupuncture on a sleeping unit. i realise i forgot to include this in my table. Zabuza was also used on a sleeping lightning main unit to apply blindness.

add 2: i have forgotten to colour the sleep-acu tiles in my table


In this experiment, I assumed:

1. if 2 debuffs of the same tier are applied, the debuff applied last will be cleared first

2. sleep, immobile, chaos are on the same tier


For my table, I have highlighted in colour the "0-0 pairs". In these cases, the debuff applied last (between 2 debuffs, irregardless of the nature of the debuff) was cleared before the debuff applied first. If our first assumption is correct, this suggests that both debuffs are on the same clear priority.


Results notes:

1. Sleep and immobile are in fact, not on the same tier as chaos (as assumed). If we assume that sleep/immobile are on the same tier as chaos, this implies chaos should be on the same tier as slow/blindness/acu/etc. which is clearly not the case.

2. Sleep and immobile do not override each other, even though sleep/chaos and immobile/chaos do. Interestingly, I think the override isn't caused by these debuffs being on the same tier (as we've clearly proved that they aren't), but more because the purpose of these 2 debuffs cannot coexist. A unit can't be compelled to act against it's team and compelled to not act at the same time.

3. Solving for "which debuff is removed first?" in cases where more than 2 debuffs are applied: 1) split the debuffs into their respective tiers, 2) pick the highest priority tier, and figure out which debuff was applied last. That's the debuff that will be removed first.

4. The assumption that debuffs on the same tier are cleared according to time of application has not been disproved.


Conclusions:

1. Debuffs on the same tier will be removed according to which debuff was applied last

2. All debuffs in bright orange are the same tier, as are the debuffs in pale orange, and pale blue-green.

3. Chaos is on it's own tier.


Some funny things i learnt:

- Regular Haku's chase and mystery are the only pure nin sources of acupuncture.

- 4 ninjas are capable of prompt, chaos-causing mystery in round 1 (3 at the moment if the mystery's sole purpose is to cause chaos): Susanoo itachi, swimsuit ino, aoneko and danzo (before breakthrough, and if he has his barrier)

- testing takes a very very long time and a lot of resources, is very tedious, and bad for your eyesight XD seriously, kudos to Icex and his regular player guides. Regularly testing for data is really no joke


This post is too little too late, but I hope you took something away from this! Thanks for reading!


...Next is to test the order of application for attacks that cause multiple debuffs in 1 action...




This post was last edited by Kuebiko on 2018-10-09 23:30:16.
  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 9
  • Posts: 98
On 2018-10-12 18:20:24Show this Author Only
2#

Nice research, good job. Liked the explanation but didn't understand the sheet well.


What are the yellow marks in the sheet?

You said sleep and immobile doesn't override but in sheet, you didn't try the second debuff with sleep.. or at least I can't understand it from there.


And for example, in case a ninja got immobilized and sleep after, using edo sasori mistery on him he will get ride of both or just the one he took first (in this case immobile)?




This post was last edited by bl0w on 2018-10-12 18:37:31.
  • Registered: 2018-02-02
  • Topics: 32
  • Posts: 2137
On 2018-10-12 18:56:41Show this Author Only
3#

Good job

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 8
  • Posts: 333
On 2018-10-12 20:18:06Show this Author Only
4#
  • bl0w On 2018-10-12 18:20:24
  • Nice research, good job. Liked the explanation but didn't understand the sheet well.


    What are the yellow marks in the sheet?

    You said sleep and immobile doesn't override but in sheet, you didn't try the second debuff with sleep.. or at least I can't understand it from there.


    And for example, in case a ninja got immobilized and sleep after, using edo sasori mistery on him he will get ride of both or just the one he took first (in this case immobile)?

Let me explain for Kue.
1. The yellow/orange mark is in the same debuff rank, same with tha pale orange and pale blue. Same debuff rank means if u apply those debuffs, the one applied last will be cleared 1st.

2. I don't understand what is your "second debuff", I guess you mean chaos. Chaos and sleep override each other, same with chaos and immobile, so if you are sleeping, then chaos, you will be chaos but awake.

3. Like the first explanation above, sleep and immoble is the same debuff rank, so if you got immobile, then sleep, edo sasori will clear sleep first.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 9
  • Posts: 98
On 2018-10-12 21:24:52Show this Author Only
5#

2. Well, it was my misunderstanding that leaves me to make that question but thank you, I understand now :P

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 50
  • Posts: 600
On 2018-10-12 21:27:07Show this Author Only
6#
  • bl0w On 2018-10-12 18:20:24
  • Nice research, good job. Liked the explanation but didn't understand the sheet well.


    What are the yellow marks in the sheet?

    You said sleep and immobile doesn't override but in sheet, you didn't try the second debuff with sleep.. or at least I can't understand it from there.


    And for example, in case a ninja got immobilized and sleep after, using edo sasori mistery on him he will get ride of both or just the one he took first (in this case immobile)?

the *orange marks:

"For my table, I have highlighted in colour (orange, pale yellow, blue gray) the "0-0 pairs". In these cases, the debuff applied last (between 2 debuffs, irregardless of the nature of the debuff) was cleared before the debuff applied first. If our first assumption is correct, this suggests that both debuffs are on the same clear priority."

In simple terms: for some cases, the debuff applied last had the highest clear priority; it didnt matter which debuff, only that the debuff was applied last. i highlighted the boxes where this was the case.


i said sleep doesnt override immobile, that's true. I did test both cases:

a) debuff 1 (row): sleep, debuff 2 (column): immobile

b) debuff 1 (row): immobile, debuff 2 (column): sleep

I understand the spreadsheet isnt the easiest thing to understand hahaha

yujin's spreadsheet is much easier to reference. u can pop over to his thread. he uses actual words XD i just found it neater to use 1s and 0s


well yujin's explained this one already.

i outlined the steps you take to solve for the highest priority debuff in the round:

1. separate the all the debuffs into tiers (in your example we only have 1 tier. sleep and immobile are in the same tier)

2. observe which debuff was applied last (in your example, sleep is applied after immobile. sleep is applied last)

since sleep and immobile don't override, sleep will be removed first, and immobile will be left (edo sasori only removes 1 debuff)




This post was last edited by Kuebiko on 2018-10-12 21:27:45.
  • Registered: 2017-07-24
  • Topics: 50
  • Posts: 600
On 2018-10-12 21:29:01Show this Author Only
7#
  • bl0w On 2018-10-12 21:24:52
  • 2. Well, it was my misunderstanding that leaves me to make that question but thank you, I understand now :P

no problem! haha my post is really quite wordy and the spreadsheet isn't very reader friendly

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