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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
Note: This post has been filtered by Daiske (Administrator)The strong becomes the weak and the cycle continues -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
Note: This post has been filtered by Daiske (Administrator)To be honest most ppl that do get plunder are * enough to deserve it, since they never ask for support and do convoy when the serve and players are most active, then they get plundered and then they blame everyone else except themself(commonly seen as"I can't do anything vs no-life P2W"). But i guess in the end it is survival of the fittest. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
Note: This post has been filtered by Daiske (Administrator)was that directed to me? -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
Note: This post has been filtered by Daiske (Administrator)First of all i don't remember saying if i do convoy or plunder at all.
And second the majority of as you said powerless players are * hence the powerlessness. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- On 2017-06-26 23:33:31
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So what happens when only strong players are left with no weak players to plunder?
The others said better than me but, it's basically the same only that the former weaker player that left are remplaced by the weaker of the strong.
That is if not all of the top ends up in the same group which is the only really active group from the server, cause y'know can't plunder group mates. In that case either everybody runs convoy or they make alts to plunder. Sometimes the strong may choose to secede from the main group in order to plunder from their former group mates and for GNW.
The strong becomes the weak and the cycle continuesPretty much. I guess those who were plundered by them would enjoy the irony.. if you know, hadn't quit their server.
To be honest most ppl that do get plunder are * enough to deserve it, since they never ask for support and do convoy when the serve and players are most active, then Depends, usally a server starts many groups get made, strong groups are defined clearly by the end of the first month. The top groups usally set a range of level and power they want to stay competitive, so the server gets set up with a collection of groups with strong people and many more with the rest of the weaker players.
As time progresses the top groups continue recruiting, generally what drives a group to become #1 is the abilitiy of the people managing it to secure strong players, regular donators and of course most of the p2w, p2p and skilled f2p. Donations are additive meaning if your group level is high people will be interested in joining and as the top group you can pick and choose who's the better choice and kick those who don't benefit you. ( Which should be obvious to anyone, but people still get *hurt about being kicked )
Strong players that somehow don't make the cut end up in groups 2, 3, 4, 5 and *tered in lower groups if they choose to join those. Competitive players that can't make it to the #1 will try for #2 or #3 asap. Groups below the top have two things working against them basically get the scraps left and as time passes the server population will start dwindling, it's not obvious at first but it will be noticeable later on. Top group will always attract some people so strong player in other groups that wanted to join but couldn't may try again as activity lowers and effectively the top group will soon have most of the strong and competitive players. This will happen unless #1's leader is a nincom* widely hated in the server lol sometimes the group #2 raises to become #1 because of stuff like this.
So from the start some groups and their members have the upperhand. Doing convoy when the server is rather new and quite active is not that bad your chances to be plundered are low and there are plenty of targets so I feel people don't worry much if the strong players in their group are done with their support or are even significantly weaker than the ones doing plunder. Cause is all a breeze everyone jokes around in world chat and chit chat in group chat. But time passes and things change. People will start noticing they get plundered more often at one point they will be plundered everytime they run SS, it's unavoidable that's how it always end up.
tbh by this point many of them already have like over 9000 complaints about things and stuff. Some people hate the top players and the top group. Pfft you can check the report of misbehavior to see how some people explode in pm or wc when plundered. One would think at the point in which you want to cuss at someone on pm you'd realize you either need to quit playing, quit doing convoy, go watch anime, quit the server, play another game, or figure something else that makes you less bitter with your free time, but noo they won't.
Some people in lower groups at a lower level and power is basically doomed to lose. Chances for support and quality of it is limited. If the strongest in the server are in one group or two and you're not in that group then there's basically no way. Is not like you can accept a convoy and run it in the middle of the night you can accept in active hours and even when people run it after active hours they can get plundered, and some plunderers adapt to plunder at such times cause they aren't dumb. There's even a program thingie now that people use so nah.
I see it like this, these people were gonna quit since the day they joined the server it just takes longer for some of them to realize that.
I suppose you have point there the problem is you and me are seeing this kinda differently since when i started there was no plunder and convoy in this sense there were earth and sky scrolls that needed to be put together etc etc not the point here. Point is that those ppl before the 2.0 plunder even in the beggining were weak and i am talking about f2p vs f2p. So in my eyes if you get plunder and you cant defend yourself now you are a *.Yes i do understand that this logic is flawed like a lot but i am talking mainly about older servers. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- On 2017-06-27 01:05:40
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Old convoy had two issues if I recall. One was repeated scrolls, if merchant spamed more of the same it was impossible to run especially when groups were small or when the few people who had the one scroll everybody needed just ran with one person and logged off or weren't interested in helping others. Lol I had so much rage reserved for those who did one run and logged off instead of the 4 runs. And if you ran it as soon as it started you got high possibilities of being plundered by players stronger than you.
I don't know if convoy back then could be blamed for quitting players because even when it was frustrating in my server what people did is try to join the stronger groups, not run it or have a partner and run it at the last possible moment when it was likely the herd of the strong players had already plundered the easy targets. I'll say one thing the strong players of the small groups always had like 10 people asking them for help all at once.
People used to name as their rage points three things: arena, matsuri and sage. Actually in my server low levels stopped doing sage and I was told more than once not to touch arena not even with a long *. I know a few people lost their patience when kurama used to take as long af to die, but I never heard of anyone quitting over it.
People in general got frustrated of losing and being unable to progress and when people left other people left because there was no one to talk. Groups would progressively die out in activity. The diference of old convoy and new convoy is that when you lost some people blamed it in their partner rather than feel bullied themselves. Is like when there's someone else, you are not the only one hurting? I guess, that's how people does see it.
Also the ratio of rewards between plunder and convoy wasn't perceived as negatively as now. Like hm, they plunder you and don't get 15 coupons out of it but even more than you would if your convoy was sucessful.
Well maybe this is the case of only my server but i don't recall over the span of 4-5 months that anyone said anything remotely close to flame back then and yea the difference between convoy and plunder were almost non-existent as in even if you could be able to do both i recall that most players didn't even bother doing plunder. Now when the plunder and convoy introduced coupons as a mean of currency ppl started getting offended since if they would lose the battle, they would lose something far more precious then coins. With that said plunder has become number 1 reason for players quitting but that will change when plunder and convoy change again but not the point here. Regarding the alts it is bannable if you get caught that is , I don't know anyone on my server that is doing that.
P.S. really nice to see someone actually giving some thoughts into his/her responses instead of just stating their mind and leaving the discussion. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- TheFlorentino On 2017-06-27 01:26:33
- I still dont know what the new plunder/convoy system will look like.
Basically we had:
First that was using sky and earth scrolls
Second that it is now
Third same as now but you can do only 1 free plunder and the cost of each next is 10 ingots and you can get second ss while convoying for 6 i believe , but on plunder you get some extra stuff besides coupons -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- Azzakye On 2017-06-27 02:57:20
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I have always said plunder is toxic and is mechanically unfriendly.
What I would love to see in a new Plunder/Convoy (Suggestion)
First plunder availability should be reversed everyone besides the top 20 in power ranking can plunder
Second top 20 have a chance of running a SSS convoy which offers a lot of rewards but any damage sustained is kept. All plunders have one free attempt at SSS convoys beside their normal 3 attempts and SSS will offer more than SS plunder.
Third removal of SS restriction
Lol no offense bro but that suggestion seems kinda lame to me, since basically you are punishing high power ppl bcs they have high power and rewarding lower/less skilled players bcs they are less skilled. I do agree that plunder is toxic and not friendly at all but its on convoyer to choose if he wants to run ss and get plunder , or if he runs 4 S. Yea having to choose between these 2 is by all means not fair but players got to adapt if they want to survive, or they can just quit. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- On 2017-06-27 02:10:46
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Honestly, I can see why it creates so much saltyness. Coupon is valuable. If I didn't get my coupons everyday like I do now. I too rage quit, they have been inmensaly helpful and getting 15 is not the same that getting 150.
Convoy back them dealt with the same frustration of players losing to players, but the thing is the ratio btw rewards wasn't seen as unequal as now. If by being plundered you knew your attacker will win 15 coupons, then a person wouldn't be as annoyed and plunderers would chose to plunder cause they like to plain villain, not like OP said bc is the best choice btw the 2.
I agree with you totally new plunder benefits stronger player way too much then it should, but you gotta see the side effects of that aswell.
We have 3 categories: Populated servers , Populatedish servers and dead ones.
Lets start with the easiest one. On dead servers ppl had more or less stopped plundering at all since the wait time is god awful, they can't get full 3 ss and/or don't want to drive those little ppl they have away.
Populatedish servers are the best places to plunder for non p2w user. Since it offers a little bit larger array of prey and the amount of stronger(p2w) users is not that high overall. Still the wait times can be , and in most cases are more then 3 hours every day mindlessly spamming the refresh *on which we can debate overall if it's worth or nah.
Last the most populated servers are the worst for almost all f2p users and low spenders since their chance of even catching the ss before the other guys is drastically lower compered to second category of servers.Even if they do catch the chances of them winning is really low.
All this said there isn't guarantee that the plundered will get any coupons so everyday that he is plundering his income is uncertain. Also the thing that most ppl are forgetting is that if you don't win your plunder you will also lose Group Contribution which is on itself a valuable resource hence even more uncertainty in plunder.
Now don't get me wrong i totally get the saltiness and why it's there, and as a plundered on my server i am happy that i am able to get 100-150 coupons everyday which rly helps me battling the rest of p2p users on my server. The only reason i see this changing without actually changing anything is if they increase the coupon gain on your SS as a convoyer to 50/25(or 30) if you win/lose. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- Azzakye On 2017-06-27 19:28:43
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Dimster, you are saying that the current self destructive plunder/convoy is good for the game its people like you who believe in moments of satisfaction than life time of happiest which really grind me the wrong way.
My suggestions do not "punish" high bp players instead I reversed the plunder restrict which currently limits the top 20 only to be able to plunder. Then give back to those top 20 something exclusive which is not at the expense of others which is the SSS convoy idea which is super high risk with battle damage being carried over. What I am doing is returning plunder and convoy to the masses and taking away plunder from the top bp for something else which will truly be a challenge.
In the end I am not "punishing high power ppl bcs they have high power and rewarding lower/less skilled players bcs they are less skilled" but removing the self destructive nature of what the current plunder/convoy is. We all agree plunder is for the strong and the weak will be killed but what I want is not the strong going after the weak but the weak challenging the strong to become stronger.
Edit: (More Rant) Dimster your apathy really just kills me reading all your posts is like having a guy say "meh, so what it happens" truly self destructive and backwards
This post was last edited by Azzakye at 2017-6-27 19:31
I don't remember saying in any way that is its good for the game and the only reason i don't even consider your idea isn't bcs it is't good(it's actually decent idea), but instead of how oasis work and the fact that plunder will follow CN no matter what we do.
P.S. "Edit: (More Rant) Dimster your apathy really just kills me reading all your posts is like having a guy say "meh, so what it happens" truly self destructive and backwards" i have no clue what you said here. -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- Azzakye On 2017-06-27 19:58:07
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Dimster its just me ranting and don't just throw away ideas just because we know oasis will update it the same as china with some minor changes. If we keep saying china this china that then 50% of these discussion forums are useless.
Lol why are you posting ideas if you know that they will never ever happen? No offense but it seems kinda desperate to me since it looks like all you want is some attention when you put it like that.Since the moment anyone disagrees with you you are acussing him of doesn't giving a **** about game basically
This post was last edited by Dimster at 2017-6-27 20:10 -
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
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- Registered: 2017-07-24
- Topics: 7
- Posts: 148
- Azzakye On 2017-06-27 20:47:59
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Dimster I can see why you have no idea as you try not to offend anyone but pretending being neutral is more offensive as your arguments are so 2 faced
Edit: you can see that its bad but still support it like WTF
My arguments are 2 faced? You mean my argument actually has a pros and cons unlike yours? Excuse me if i offended you by not agreeing with your idea . Looks like you are entitled to have your own opinion on plunder but i am not apparently... -
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