Well, when it comes to weighing Seal Scrolls = Cave keys, it's little hard since both can give good outputs .. But as of now i think, having cave keys is much what i needed since my Initiative needs a little boost to atleast compete with some guys in our server, since we got merged with other servers and now i'm experiencing plunders again after long time xD ..

i go based off coupons value :P?

As long as you dont level up your refine lvl, that event gives way more value that normal "spend x refines" event.

are you sure if you use them on this event that is 200 less for the 500 one which gives you a breakthrough pill. Not that you can't get more refines but you only have so many refines possible to use before you no longer have gear to be able to level

imo, it's worth it if you are just going to use medium and basic runes.

Use advanced to get some wish points then, they start from 0/200, 0/500, 0/1000 so u have plenty of room to distribute them without fear of early upgrade. All that matters is you dont level up, because you would lose 25% wish credit from time limited refining. Also pill is worthless for f2p, small and medium spenders. On lvl10 refine piece one pill gives 6.65 of each secondary stat, which is about 10 power in total and considering it's price, who cares about that :-)

You might not have enough to refine duirng normal refine rebate this even cycle, but if you skip one rebate and wait for other you basically trade those 10(20?) adv refines you'd get for 23 myoboku gifts, 10 capsules and 6 seal scrolls from current rebate, which is worth way more.

well if you think its worthless for f2p you could say that about every power item in the game because you are never going to be the strongest. But everything helps :o

Honestly, for f2p its better to use 200refine rebate few times instead of grinding refines for months to get 500. Doing 200rebate 5 times gives u more adv refines than doing 500 twice and both take the same time. Even at this point simply more refines should have priority over pill.

f2p needs to take advantage of every possible power advancement they should not care about if they get a few more refines they should care that eventually they will have more than those that didnt get the pill

Here's where you are wrong. 1 Piece of gear requires 1700 adv refines, thats 34 000 in total for all 20 pieces. Even if you cut that number in half by using wish credit and luck, thats still 17 000 adv refines. Using cheapest refine price from treasure of the sages, thats 17000*22cp=374 000coupons. Alternatively, you get 15 adv refines for 1st place in sage- you need to win 1334 SWB (thats 3sages for 444 weeks= 8.5 years). Take into account that to this scenario less than 1% of our ftp players can relate, because others are simply not strong enough for swb.

TL;DR as ftp, you will virtually never finish upgrading advanced refines. While still on lower refine lvl (7-8) those refines can give u whole level over time for free. But honestly, at this point it takes so much time it actually doesnt matter if you pick pill or more refines, because you wont play long enough to see what would've happen if you chose otherwise.

Did you take into account the ability to buy refines with coins in the updated shop?

I have to win over the long run approach I am not wrong rather you think it takes to long to complete doesnt make me wrong. If we both played long enough to get there eventually I would be right :)

No refine rebate tomorrow. Lol. End of discussion. If you don't wanna do the 7 days welfare, then don't. Already got my precious rewards today~

no rebate tomorrow doesnt matter to this discussion there will be another one eventually

Given the required time, yeah, you are right. If we all actively play for next decade, you will come out on top with pills, I was just pointing out a more "short term" realistic scenario. I didnt consider silver coin shop, just as well as no other sources of refines. I take back what I've said about you being wrong. We just approached this from a different angle, doesn't mean any of us is actually wrong. Anyway since the topic is about today's rebate, not the regular rebate we have, let's not dwell into this any further because thread will be locked.

Still think that today's 200' rebate is better than average 200' rebate.

Idk why you keep failing to understand my point about you saying "you've lost your wish credits that would have been for rebate event".
Do you really think you've got the same luck to succeed refining with just 10 refines during the rebate? NO. Of course not.
Your luck today doesn't mean it's going to be the same on other days. That's a wishful thinking.
And like I said, if you don't wanna spend and stuff, don't. Scram.

maybe you should scram? you gave your opinion . The reason no one uses refinements is incase it happens to level you up it doesnt matter if it happens to you you are out the wish tokens that is a real thing. If you dont care about those tokens do this rebate . if you do care about it then its risky. You seem to have a hard time understanding this

A bit rich coming from someone who couldn't read people's main response. I get it some people are just unfortunate enough to be unable to comprehend the details that make up a certain issue complex, not just a black and white kind of thing. For those who has refines but NOT enough to reach the 500 refine rebate mark, I said, the welfare event was just fitting and has a better value as compared to that of the refine rebate's. The moment you keep spouting about some lost luck or something that you would have on refine rebates just speaks about how you're unable to understand the rules of probability and its mutable values through time. You know what Dunning-Kruger means? Probably not. Try not looking it up. Some people keep talking, insisting, and not even aware of the higher logical systems of reasons relative to the various factors associated with the subject, yet thinks of others as having a hard time processing their meager reasoning. I wouldn't have my refines over 7+ if I didn't care about your poor wish credit/leveling up arguments. Granted you've leveled one up, what are the odds of you ever advancing it to the next higher level? I wouldn't argue if you have saved over 500+ refine runes, which BTW, I also mentioned in my past replies. You barely even have enough to reach the 500th mark and you keep talking about some lame what-ifs.

depends on how bad you want it, i was going to refine but the lucky stars wheel had charms and the chance of shisui and sasuke susanoo frags + the scrolls so i just leveled my charms since i won in just about every aspect

i got the charms, the scrolls, and susanoo frags, plus limited points to buy more summoning scrolls and susanoo frags

Except the pill is not just worthless for f2p, but worthless to even to players who spend thousands every month. The only people that get anything out of pills are the super whales at the very top of a server cluster.

Even if you are given 10 years, and far more generous rewards from events and shops, you will NEVER reach the point of pills being remotely cost effective. The only reason it even have a value for the super whales.. is because they maxed out everything else that can provide init.